AMR: WoW Update

Mr. Robot has a big update today! Optimize now!

  • STAT WEIGHTS: Updated default stat weights for Prot Paladins (incorporated Theck’s suggestions),  Prot warriors (increased Stamina, make it easier on your healers), and Shadow Priest (takes into account devouring plague haste threshold).
  • OPTIMIZATION: Fixed bugs in the optimization algorithm that should give better reforging in most cases, but this might mean that your suggested reforges will change, even if your gear didn’t change.
  • ITEMS: Added a few missing Heroic and LFR items, removed bad items, removed deprecated items, fixed stats on some items, and fixed a few unique-equip bugs.
  • NEW PPM Mechanic: We updated Windsong and Elemental Force to use the new PPM system.
  • RUN SPEED STACKING: fixed Death Knights’ talent, “Death’s Advance” to allow stacking with “Pandaren’s Step” (the boot run speed enchant). Mr. Robot will now suggest run speed even if you have the DK talent. You can still choose ‘exclude run speed enchants’ in the options menu.
  • BELT BUCKLES: (actually live in a previous update, but wanted to share). Belt buckles are now included in the “Exclude Expensive Enchants” option in the options window.
  • SHOPPING LIST: The shopping list is back :)
  • MISC BUG FIXES:
    • Fixed a bug where you couldn’t lock in meta gems
    • Fixed a bug that suggested BoA Inscription weapons to people who didn’t have inscription
    • We marked a bunch of items as BoE World Drops. We’ll continue to update source info as we find it.
    • Mr. Robot’s favorite pizza is now meat lovers, we accidentally had it listed as “everything.” He said robots don’t need vegetables, so we corrected our mistake.

  • Znuff

    Ha! So that Meta was a bug… thought I was doing something wrong…

  • lvnotrx

    I have attempted several times to access AMR from my IE8 but continually get the message that I need to upgrade to IE9 or use Mozilla Firefox to access for optimal performance of AMR. First, I don’t want to upgrade to IE9 at this time as I plan some upgrades to my entire computer setup (hardware and programs) at a later date.. Second, I don’t use Mozilla Firefox (though I have it installed) because I don’t like Mozilla Firefox. Why can’t I still access AMR with IE8 if that’s how I choose to? Are you getting a kick-back for the upgrade to IE9?

    • Logbo

      I would think its due to Microsoft Silverlight, and Javascript not being supported as well in ie8, if this was causing bugs in the stats output AMR was giving you, then AMR would be useless. While you may Plan on computer upgrades later, upgrading to ie 9 is a 5 min job, not to mention the fact you said you have FF installed. so really. your overall message i personally get from your comment is “im to lazy to click on that other icon on my ddesktop and want you to fix that for me.”

    • Johnzzon

      It’s clear that you have never developed a site for IE8. Trust me, it’s a fuckin pain. And that’s even with a standard information website. Now with a site as advanced as AMR I can only imagine how hard it would be to get IE8 to cooperate.
      Most developers these days do not support IE8 so it’s not a reasonable request you are making.

    • http://www.facebook.com/ritchie.villavicencio Ritchie Villavicencio

      You can’t expect the developers to make your old browser to work, upgrade your browser or don’t use the site.

    • zoopercat

      I’m sorry it doesn’t work in IE8, but IE8 doesn’t support the modern CSS and other HTML5 standards. It takes a lot of extra work to support IE8, when we could spend that time developing cool features instead :) Upgrading to other browsers is free and easy. You might also want to look into upgrading to IE9, using Firefox or Chrome, as a lot of companies have dropped support for IE8 or are dropping it soon. Google is one of them, dropping support in November: http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9231316/Google_to_drop_support_for_IE8_on_Nov._15

    • http://twitter.com/perringaiden Perrin

      You know, if you wanted to offset the ‘kickback’ they’re getting for not supporting out of date POS browsers, you could you know… pay. I’d say no more than maybe $5000 to spend the time supporting you and you alone (ignoring all the grandparents out there who don’t know how to upgrade their web browser). Problem solved!

    • Teh BuG

      use google chrome. problem solved.

  • http://twitter.com/perringaiden Perrin

    Any word on when Guardian’s will be updated?

  • Eow

    I’m hit capped atm on my warrior, but mrrobot still tells me to reforge to hit -.- actually it even shows me that after I modified those stats I have less hit and less expertise. I’m trusting notepad for now…

    • AskMrRobot

      Mr. Robot must have removed hit somewhere else, cogwheels in a trinket perhaps? If you give me your character name and realm I will look into it.

    • Sneakypanda

      I had that problem too, but then I saw that some gems were different and so was one of my enchants. Can’t just look at the reforges :)

  • Rustyboy

    After seeing that Mr.Robot was updated I thought I’d give it another go.. I was wrong, the reforging tool is unable to maintain a min hit cap which is useless for any reforging as hit/exp caps are #1 priority for PvP And PvE. Always been a problem with AMR and looks like it still will be.

    • AskMrRobot

      Getting exactly to the hit cap doesn’t always result in the most DPS. I have an explanation in another post that might interest you: http://blog.askmrrobot.com/2012/10/how-does-mr-robots-optimizer-work#2

      • Rustyboy

        Run 100,000 sim iterations and make half just slightly over hit cap and the other half slightly under hit cap what you will find is there is no clear winner. Wipe to a boss with 100k hp left and miss a Kill Shot which would have done 140k or miss on an ability that’s was going to kill the healer on 10k hp before he heals himself to full, that’s the difference, in reality missing at crucial times is the difference not missing when it doesn’t count. My suggestion is to run multiple reforge options one which can go below hit/exp caps and one which makes sure you are 100% capped, you can then show the difference based on stat weights and let the user decide if losing 50dps is worth being capped or not. I would use the site a lot more if I just had that option, setting a cap higher and higher until both hit/exp is capped on a reforge tool is sort of going against its purpose in the first place.

        • revulva

          This argument about wiping on a fight because you miss one crucial ability because you aren’t 100% capped is ridiculous, in statistical terms. Math incoming (This is for being 0.25% under the hit cap):

          A more thorough and accurate mathematical model can be made with Bernoulli trials. With 500 ability uses or auto attacks and a .0025 success probability (checking for misses), you get this distribution:

          P(0) = 0.28606
          P(1) = 0.35847
          P(2) = 0.22415
          P(3) = 0.093257
          P(4) = 0.029041
          P(5) = 0.0072201
          P(6) = 0.0014929
          P(7) = 0.00026405

          There is a 28.6% chance you won’t miss at all, 35.847% chance that you’ll miss once, and 22.4% chance that you’ll miss twice. And so on. In all, that means there’s a better than 50% chance in a normal boss fight that you’ll miss once or not at all. There’s a 96% chance that you’ll miss 3 or less times.

          Now, extend this further to: what are the chances that one miss will occur when… the boss is less than 1% health AND that this miss will occur on a Kill Shot. The number will be so low that you have a better chance of getting hit by lightning, literally. And you have a MUCH better chance that you, or someone else on your team, will randomly disconnect during the fight ;)

          Being very slightly under the hit cap will not be noticeable – and these hypothetical raid-wiping events are so unlikely… that they aren’t worth worrying about. Mr. Robot does not even put in an option for an “at least” condition on hit-caps because it is statistically insignificant. If you, as a user, don’t care about being completely optimal, just change one reforge to put you over the cap. It doesn’t matter which reforge it is, since you are already choosing to aim for a slightly sub-optimal solution to appease a statistically irrational compulsion.

          • xxjonesy87

            Hey, I just met you, and this is crazy, but your numbers. are spot on baby.

          • Rustyboy

            The truth of the matter is by analysing each raid encounter that I do and working out better ways to optimise my performance in regards to ability use/positioning etc. I will gain more dps increases than using manual reforging compared to an automatic reforge tool.

            However when I look at my logs I don’t ever want to miss and if you armory guilds like paragon they will all be hit capped unless there is no benefit to actually being capped (Tanks is some cases etc). Why do I bring this up? because guilds like these do encounters in the minimal amount of gear possible, if being below hit cap was optimal you would see it. They don’t because they study the logs and know that if two people miss on an add it could mean death to the tank in another two globals and maybe if that add died the tank would have survived.

            What I want and at a guess most people want from an automatic reforge tool is to minimise any loss of stats If I am over the cap, I don’t mind being 0.25 over hit cap if it’s optimal while making sure I’m capped. If I’m 0.80 over hit cap I want to be able to come to a site like AMR and see if it can suggest a better reforge to minimise the stat loss or suggest maybe a different piece of gear which will get me closer to optimal setup.

            Instead of giving me math based on the chances of missing and saying its not worth it, can you tell me how much dps gain I would get from being slightly under cap and getting 0.25 more crit? Is it worth it? I don’t think so. How do you improve performance? You minimise the variables and maximise the constants, being capped is something that’s going to be constant. If your capped you never have to think about it again and actually focus on the important stuff like playing the game which is why most end game raiders worth their salt make sure they are capped.

            On another note sites like this attract a lot of beginners just starting to raid etc. Teaching them that being below cap is O.K. is not the best thing. Guild applications or GM/Officers looking at their members gearing will say get capped or why aren’t you capped? irrespective of any argument you provide here.

          • revulva

            The math I posted was to demonstrate that being within 0.25% (or even 0.5%) of the hit cap – either above OR below is statistically insignificant. That is why the optimization algorithm does not enforce either constraint. It just finds a good solution close to the hit cap. Sometimes it goes over, sometimes it does not.

            If you are within 0.25% of the hit cap… you don’t have to worry about missing at all. There is a very high probability (near 100%) that your one or two misses in a fight will happen on an inconsequential ability at an inconsequential time.

            I don’t understand why people are so obsessed with removing randomness from a video game in the first place. Why? The game IS random. Your DPS fluctuates wildly due to crit, random events in a boss fight, etc. You lose close boss fights much more often because of those fluctuations than because of some extraordinarily unlikely event like missing that ONE ability at that ONE time that it actually matters! Your example of two people missing a hit at the same time on the same add in a boss fight… is less likely than getting hit by lightning. I don’t know about you, but I don’t go around with a rubber cage around me – even though I could do that.

            My point again: It just doesn’t matter if you are a little below the hit cap. It really, truly does not. If you want to get above the hit cap to satisfy your personal compulsion, the optimizer lets you do that. We might even add an option in to do it automatically, since so many people are asking for it… but, we won’t stop pointing out that people are being irrational.

            People’s innate misunderstanding of statistics and random trials is why gambling makes so much money.

          • Rustyboy

            I understand statistics but I also understand reality.

            Phil Hellmuth’s play style in NL Texas Hold’em poker is based around statistics, he plays a lot of tournaments and performs very well because overall the numbers are eventually going to come his way the more hands he plays. However in some tournaments the numbers will go against him so much its almost impossible for him to stay in a tournament irrespective of how tight he plays.

            You and I may never be hit by lightning or even know anyone who has, however there are people who put themselves into a situations which increases their chances and have been hit multiple times in their lifetime. Even if you go and play golf during lightning storms you may never get hit, that doesn’t mean people who decide not to play golf that day are irrational and don’t understand statistics. At the end of the day if you get hit and die your dead.

            My point is that being slightly above the hit cap and losing some minor stat is not going to make any enough of a dps difference so why not statistically remove the chance of missing entirely. That means when your in a situation where you only have 10 globals to do damage then you know every one of your damaging abilities will hit. Your argument is based on statistics over a long time and mine is based around individual and sometimes very short situations.

            If I use a damaging ability 1000 times (1 sec each) @ 50,000 damage per hit and I miss 5 times, then my max dps will be 50,000 and my actual dps will be 49,750 so it’s not a big loss.

            Now if I use an ability 10 times (1 sec each) @ 50,050 and miss once my actual dps is 45,045 however If I cap myself my dps will be 50,000. If I miss once over 10 ability uses I need a dps gain of over 11% (55,560 per hit) to just edge in front of the guy who is capped.

            In wow you don’t get 100,000 goes at something, sometimes you only get a few of hundred when raiding on each encounter and in pvp it’s even less so when that bad rng hits you and not the other guy you die and he doesn’t. When your under geared and need every global to count and you get bad rng then you wipe or you get another set of adds because you couldn’t push the boss past 50% to start the next phase and you wipe anyway because you run out of time.

            Being capped = Being consistent and being able to rely on your abilities 100% of the time.

            Being slightly under capped = Gaining very little with the chance of the RNG gods giving it to you hard.

            For a lot of casual players I would say meh whatever, but when you are running a site which is used as a tool to optimise gear in a game like wow that has end game raiding and pvp you are going to attract a lot of people who care about the small things and being capped is always going to be number 1 unless Blizzard decide to change the way the game works.

          • revulva

            I guess I’m just the kind of person that doesn’t worry about extremely unlikely events that will have no effect on my life. I don’t plan to win the lottery. I don’t worry about getting hit by lightning. I don’t optimize my gear in WoW for the theoretical situation where my raid wipes because I missed one particular ability. I don’t go to Vegas and expect to win money. I have sex even though birth control isn’t 100% effective. Life is full of random crazy events that aren’t worth worrying about.

            I think this obsession with removing statistically insignificant events “just because you can” in WoW is an interesting commentary on psychology.

          • Rustyboy

            I’m a big believer in life to focus on things that you can control/effect and can have a big impact on your life. You might say I don’t believe in being capped so why should I add a setting to be capped on my site which in turn may make people not use it because you can’t set it as an option in the first place. A lot of people use reforgelite and even that has its problems. However a site where someone can just load up their character, change some settings (caps included) but also recommend upgrades and where to get them from without having to deal with small quirks (reforgelite needs manual adjustments to get the best results, wowreforge’s interface is clunky) will be a very popular tool. More people coming to this site I would presume will benefit the site.

          • http://profiles.google.com/epiccollision Epic Collision

            the reality is is that it just isn’t significant, humans are creatures that see patterns where there are none and superstition and myths are held in esteem above facts and science…have a belief in something that has been proven to not exist statistically is simply ignorant.

  • http://www.facebook.com/krazyito65 Leon Solis III

    Can we get the shopping list to link the enchant to Wowhead or WoWDB like the gems and enchanting mats?

    • AskMrRobot

      I like that idea, adding it to a list of features.

  • FrozenGhost

    I just got this crafted /script DEFAULT_CHAT_FRAME:AddMessage(“124cffa335ee124Hitem:77533:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0124h[Lightweight Retinal Armor]124h124r”); (LIGHTWEIGHT RETINAL ARMOR) but AMR can´t see it :)

    • Krav

      Try to log out then back in to WoW and update AMR then.

  • http://www.facebook.com/warngard Christian Warngård

    Fix your mistweaver monk stat weights, it says to go for haste but thats incorrect, its haste to 8.something % then mastery

  • Rovar

    Brewmaster: The hard cap at 15% doent work…even if you put manually 900 stat weight in expertise…mr robot never give you more than 7.5%…

  • Teh BuG

    FYI My Tauren Herb/Alch is still having the BOA Inscription staff suggested as BiS Pre-Raid. i dont have inscription. might want to try that fix again.

    • AskMrRobot

      Wow, I apologize for completely missing this comment, it got caught in spam filters for some reason. Anyway, since those inscription items are BoA, only one of your characters needs inscription. We have no way of knowing if you have access to an alt with inscription, so we suggest it. You can uncheck it from the item list and he won’t suggest it anymore. We can revisit this and see if we want to add an option in for people who don’t have inscription.

  • Rovar

    Brewmaster: The hard cap at 15% doent work…even if you put manually 900 stat weight in expertise…mr robot never give you more than 7.5%…

    • Krav

      Why would you want any more than 7.5% exp to begin with? There is a reason that it is set at 7.5% because going any further than that would be a waste.

      • Rovar

        brewmaster exp cap is 15%

    • revulva

      It works for me… I can optimize a Brewmaster to 15% expertise by just changing the soft-capped weight to 0.85, starting form the default stat weights. Make sure to clear your browser cache.

  • Maximus

    Any update on the “gear planner?”

    • zoopercat

      Yeah – later this year. We’re working on it and we’re making progress. I’m excited to use it myself :)

      • Maximus

        Sick! Sounds awesome

  • http://twitter.com/zothen_thunderp Zothen Thunderpants

    Not sure if you were aware, but the high-end bracer enchants are +180, not +170. This was hotfixed (you can see the +180 stats on your gear), but the enchantment tooltip hasn’t been updated yet and still says 170.

    • zoopercat

      Thanks for the note – I’ll check into that and get it updated.

  • Zekwin

    I’m confused about the strength trinket for combat rogues “Carbonic Carbuncle”. I know trinkets are different in MOP, but why is this one better than an agility trinket (i.e. it’s better than the “Dislodged Stinger” I have currently). Not sure how strength stat weights affect a combat rogue, unless it’s ignoring that and just going by the proc on the trinket?

  • Vercetor

    Kind of annoyed with AMR, this used to be the greatest site, but lately i cant trust it. The stat weights for BM hunters are COMPLETELY wrong, making it hard to trust. i have this site telling me one thing, but when i put the correct stat weights in on Reforgelite for example, i see my DPS sky rocket, but when i change my stat weights on here to custom, they are still incorrect. DO you actually plan on fixing your stat weights and upgrading your website so it correctly displays the correct loot, reforges, gems, ect? or do you plan to slack off and let this website fail?

  • Gan

    Mr robot is trying to give me 1% more hit then i need, wasap? Hunter, Ganwolfclaw on Defias Brotherhood